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05/28/2011 4:24:00 AM
I DO SO LOVE THE BLOGS-IT IS SO WONDERFUL TO SPIT SUBVERSION AND LIABLE UNRESTRAINED BY THOSE I WISH TO BELLIGERENTLY OFFEND. IT I-S INTENTIONAL, AND I PLEAD GUILTY TO BEING UNREPENTANT! MY THOUGHT-IF THEY DO NOT ACCEPT MY EFFORTS AS A BUILDER OF STRUCTURE, I WILL USE THAT EDUCATION AS A SWORD OF "SELECTIVE ENTICEMENT"/ THE CHOICE OF RECONCILIATION IS PURELY THE CHOICE OF THOSE WHO WE COME TO UNDERSTAND, ARE NOT CAPABLE OF HONOR OR FRIENDLINESS. THE CHOICE-IS THEIRS. I MERELY WIELD THE VERBAL SWORD.
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05/28/2011 3:55:00 AM
GINA-TO UNDERSTAND-I GOTTA "OUT MYSELF". MY BIAS IS NOT FOR OR AGAINST GAYS-AS A FACT-I AM AS DYSFUNCTIONAL BIOLOGICALLY SPEAKING-AS A SPACE ALIEN. IT DOESN'T ENTER INTO MY PERCEPTIONS-WHICH ARE REVOLUTIONIST AND POINTEDLY AND WICKEDLY BIASED. THE TOWN-IS OPEN TO ALL VISITORS-BUT IT IS FAR FROM THE AMBIANCE THAT I REMEMBER WHEN GROWING UP! MY WICKED AND VIOLENT BIAS COMES FROM THE OUTSOURCED SECURITY INDUSTRY THAT I SERVED FOR THIRTY-SOME-ODD YEARS-AND LEFT ME WITH A NOTION OF JUST HOW ROTTEN HUMAN BEINGS CAN BE TO ONE ANOTHER! IT CAN PEPPER AN OTHERWISE KIND SOUL TO BE RATHER JADED AND BELLIGERENT-WITH A HEAVY SARCASTIC OVERTONE. YA WOULDN'T WANT A DATE WITH THIS "WARHORSE"-EVEN IF THERE WAS A DESIGNATION FOR SEXUAL VARIETY! IT ISN'T THAT I AM UNCARING OR DON'T PITCH IN TO HELP OTHERS-JUST ALL MY ASSOCIATES HAVE NEVER TRUSTED NOR RESPECTED MY EFFORTS-AND THAT IS WHY MIAMI FOLKS ARE DEMENTED-ALONG WITH BEING VERY BROKE. OH YEH-I WAS A STETSON GRADUATE IN PHILOSOPHY-IMPRESSIVE, HUH? AGAIN-THE ISSUE IS NOT GAY-ISSUES IN MY MIND---IT IS UNKINDNESS TOWARDS EVERYONE AND SELFISHNESS ISSUES---WE HAVE A TOWN OF SELFISH PEOPLE THAT ARE SELF-CENTERED AND NARROW-MINDED! I JUST PUT MY OBSERVATIONS OF THE 14TH STREET DINER BASED ON ONE HILARIOUSLY BARFED ENCOUNTER WITH TWO TATOO QUEENS SITTING THERE. GOD-THEY WERE UGLY! JUST MY TWISTED HUMOR ON A SHORT-FUSE DAY!
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03/20/2011 6:46:00 AM
gee guyzzzz-I don't split hairs over gay or straight issues-if I am on South Beach-I carry the 40 caliber gun tucked in the waistband-because as I have said repeatedly----I know it is worse off in those streets then right before the drug days when every low-life rolled the streets. There is no money left, no glitz, and you just wouldn't meet a guy or gal (STRAIGHT OT GAY) that you would risk your life over.! JUST DON'T....!!!!
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03/20/2011 6:39:00 AM
I LIVE IN THE CITY, WORKED ENDLESSLY ON SOUTH BEACH AT CONDOS AND OTHER SECURITY DIVES----AND WHAT SAVING GRACE OR GLORY D-O-E-S THIS DUMP HAVE? VERSACE-HE'S FERTILIZER-THE DRUGS, THE RUSSIAN AND ROMANIAN WHORES---I WOULDN'T TOUCH THEM WITH A WINKIE'S SPEAR! WHAT-WHERE IS THE BIG EXCITEMENT? WE GOT TOURIST TRAP STORES, OVERPRICED HOLE-IN-THE-WALL RESTAURANTS FEATURING WASHED-UP CULINARY HAS-BEENS, AND YA GOTTA GIVE A BIG DEPOSIT IN OLD RUN-DOWN REFURBISHED HOTELS FOR "AMBIANCE"! WHERE IS YOUR FANTASY COMING FROM, BUD?1 I REPEAT-I LIVE HERE----NO SNOWBALLS BENEATH THE PALM TREES------COMEON,BE SERIOUS!
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03/20/2011 6:27:00 AM
THE TOURISTS DON'T REALIZE IT HAS BEEN "A NAKED" BEACH FOR ALL-IT HAS BEEN THAT WAY FOREVER! MIAMI BEACH,AS A WHOLE. WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A GAMBLING BEACH-A NUDIST FRIENDLY BEACH---BUT IT CAN'T RID ITSELF OF THE PERVERTS! WE ARE SORRY-BUT GOD HELP YOU IF YOU EAT AT THE 14TH STREET DINNER-AND THE TATTOOS ON THE FAT BLACK HOG WOMEN JUMP YOUR ASS AND MAKE YOU SUBMIT TO TORTURE IN THE BROOM CLOSET (HAHAHA-LOL!) THARRR SHE BLOWS! I WUZ SNOOKERED BY MS. MOBEY DICKLESS-AND HER SHIP ART WAS ROLLING LIKE A TSUNAMI,MOMMY! (WHY WOULD ANYONE GO TO WRETCHED MIAMI BEACH?1 ARE YOU NUTS? THE MOVIE PRODUCTIONS, MODELS, GANGSTERS--ALL GONE. JUST KITTY LITTERS BORN TO FOUL MUGGERS IN THE LITTLE BACK ALLEYS-NO EXCITEMENT-JUST SAD...
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Miami Beach Guy 02/25/2011 12:44:00 PM
Natalie O'Neill's article is wildly sensationalized and contains significant errors of fact. She succeeded in stirring controversy, but hasn't done much else.
READ:
http://miamiherald.typepad.com/gaysouthflorida/2010/01/miami-new-times-gays-flee-dangerous-south-beach-for-broward-no-1-in-gay-hate-crimes.html
http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2010/01/guest-post-bradley-carlson.html
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RANDMAJESTIC 09/27/2010 3:32:00 AM
GET RID OF THE SURPLUS STORE WITH SEEDY COPS;DON'T NEED BUT ONE HEAD-SHOP ON WASHINGTON AVENUE, AND PUT BACK CRAFT STORES AND CIGAR MAKERS AND WINE-AND-CHEESE OUTDOOR CAFES AND WALKING GARDENS-KARDASHIANS CAN STAY AS LONG AS KIM STRUTS HER NICELY OILED BUTT ON THE BEACH (THREE THUMBS UP, KIM-GREAT BOD!)BUT PLEASE (OMG ALMIGHTY NOOOOOOO....)-NO BLACK OVERWEIGHT GREASED TATTOO TOTEM THUG GIRLS WITH ROLLS OF FAT JIGGLING AND TALKING TRASH WITH SLIMY EGGS DROOLING FROM THEIR LIPS AT THE 14 STREET DINER TRAILER.!SOMETHING ABOUT FATTIES WITH UGLY NECKER TATTS SHOWING OFF THEIR HAIRY DRAINAGE DITCH CLEAVAGES---WHILE YOU ARE TRYING TO EAT BREAKFAST (WHATCHA LOOKIN AT WHITE-BOY---?!!) ( TRYIN' REAL HARD NOT TO LOOK AT YOU, THUGG HO CADAVER-BREATH-MIGHT TOSS MY COOKIES ALL OVER YOUR MUTANT-UGLY FACE!)(THIS IS THE LAND OF "THE THREE KINGS" (lol)hahahahah!)AHHHHHH-THOSE GHETTO BEASTS-NOT EVEN FIT FOR MEDICAL CADAVERS---TO WEIRD LOOKING FOR A RON ZOMBIE FLICK EXTRA---GET THEM THE F++++OFF THE SACRED SHORES!NO WONDER THEY CALL THE NORTHWEST SECTION "THE HOOD"-SOME OF THESE FOLKS LOOK LIKE BENT FENDERS!(AND THESE ARE THE FEMALE CORRECTIONAL GUARDS OUT AND ABOUT TOWN-AHHHHHHHHH-SHOOT ME BEFORE I GO TO THAT JAIL-AHHHHHHHHHHHH!
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RAND THINK-TANK 09/27/2010 3:07:00 AM
When i worked security on the beach ay SOBE-it morphed over the years. The cocaine cowboys-the models, the parties, the "thugga-piggy"9WHICH, ADMITTEDLY, CHASED AWAY THE CULTURE BEFORE, AND DISCOURAGED LOCAL VISITATION.But the money dried up-the economy is way sour-like never seen in our lifetime. I saw the downfall of Versache, and the entire infiltration of the Russian mob running the sex trafe and the drug trade. iY IS A PRECARIOUS LITTLE SPIT OF LAND THAT MOVES THROUGH TIME, LIKE THE STORY OF "BRIGADOON"-here one day-in the clouds the next. All I cansay is-I carry a gun on the beach-and we don't take kindly to folks mugging queers or straights-MIAMI IS STILL OUR CITY-AND I DEFEND EVERY INCH OF IT (didn't HOWARD say something like that about the UNIVERSITY OF NEBRASKA FOOTBALL TEAM?)-yeh-do if it is seedy and unfriendly-inviye the guards back and we'll make it safe for everyone----but clean it up!
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flyegirl 08/20/2010 1:12:00 PM
My wife and I a lesbian couple who recently married in the state Connecticut decided to end the last leg of our very long beach hoping honeymoon by visiting my hometown Miami's South Beach (considered a gay friendly destination) It was a real disappointment to realized that all the things that used to make South Beach awesome were no longer. Instead we found ourselves surrounded by trash tourists and we where handled as such by the people who now run the beach. Much to our dismay, on our last day we where harassed by a creepy foreigner who intended to photograph us for bathing topless at the gay beach on 12 street. It is with heaviness that I say I will not likely return, not only because SOBE has lost its character but also I felt unsafe and targeted at my very home. I wish I'd read this article before our visit and it would have spared me from personally experiencing the disillusionment from my childhood memories.
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voyeur 06/03/2010 6:43:00 AM
I'm not sure quite what this assembly of postings represent, but many comments don't sound like the Miami Beach I know and experience daily. I hope the mean-spirited comments posted here are forces that stay away or are pulled away by the tide. My sense is that most of the thugs and mean spirits aren't living here, but drive in. More than ten years ago, I was chased by drive-by gay bashers trying to impress girl friends. That was an alarming experience that I don't wish on anyone, man or woman, gay or straight. Other places with much stronger gay communities living side-by-side with other communities have similar problems--it's not unique. Too bad humans can't relax and get along, life is too short to have to deal with all the crap of who's insulted by who is kissing whom. Give me a break.
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Ty 02/09/2010 7:23:00 AM
I was a straight man, walking along Washington Ave. on a typically balmy evening on my way to a club. My gay buddy had lent me one of his fabulous open collar shirts and I was feeling sexy and ready for the night. As I walked, a car pulled along side me and two guys jumped out. "You fucking faggot," one of them said. They came after me, arms swinging. Unfortunately I was bigger, meaner and more sober than they. My first punch landed square on attacker number one's face and he plopped to the ground. Attacker number two grabbed me at the waist and we wrestled on the sidewalk. I somehow managed to throw him down beneath me, punching him multiple times. By then his friend had gotten back up and was at me from behind. I used an old wrestling move and used my arm to throw him down. At this point I kicked and punched as hard as I could and the two losers staggered to the car. I noticed a woman in the driver seat as they sped away. To this day I can only see replay this scene in my mind: only I always imagine what it could have been had I not been sober and ready to defend myself. There are haters everywhere but those that bash gays are cowards. For once they got their just due.
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Gina 02/04/2010 9:51:00 PM
The problem with SoBe are the people that have come to visit and have stayed. If you don't like the gay lifestyle, then don't come to South Beach. Very simple. SoBe started changing after the 1999 Super Bowl. We used to go every weekend on motorcylcles up till right after the Super Bowl. We don't like the atmosphere there. Take it as you wish, only telling the truth. And NO I am NOT racist. So don't even go there. People just need to start behaving civilized. Gays don't bother anyone....But YOU DO!!!!!
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Mr. BIG 02/03/2010 3:48:00 AM
GAYS/LESBIANS/ETC. ARE SEEKING PEACE AND ACCEPTANCE but refuse to accept their demonstrative behaviors, where they advertise their sexual orientation, IS REPUGNANT TO OTHERS! If they were more private, as many are, how would they ever be in the situations where they are molested. ALSO, WHY SHOULD OTHERS FEEL ALIENATED FROM AREAS OF SOUTH BEACH because it becomes an 'Alternative Lifestyle Zone'
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jake 02/03/2010 2:09:00 AM
Great news. Now we'll just pray for the rest of white trash escorts, who speak and behave like black thugs, full of ugly tats and throwing signs like a retard, to leave. Who was the genius in the City who brought that "thug week" event to our island? Do you want to impress us? Go get a MBA from a reputable college and show a 850 Fico score. You too realtor wannabes.
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JF 02/03/2010 1:48:00 AM
Dear author,
1. Why did you conveniently omit the fact that Andrew Cunanan, a GAY PROSTITUTE, shot Versace on the head? How do you call that, gay ghetto?
2. Please provide stats of straight people who were attacked on SoBe, in the same period. Let's compare it.
3. Provide number of businesses owned by straight people that have closed down in the same period. Let's compare it.
4. I bet you voted for Obama and love liberals like Edwards.
5. So, do like the liberals. When they lose, like Air America and MSNBC, they try to force legislation to shut down or tax everybody else who's competent and successful. Ask Obama to pass legislation to shut down the successful businesses on South Beach, owned by straight "breeders".
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Enzo 02/03/2010 1:02:00 AM
What, these "saints" ran out of condos to flip and got tired of treating patrons like crap? I remember always having to deal with bitchy gays at restaurants and bars on SoBe. As a matter of fact, there were lots of angry gays at Lola Bar and Pink. Never went back there again and told everyone I knew to never go to those two joints. I guess it worked. Note to gays: If you don't like people (specially straight), or frustrated for not having a glam job, don't go for the hospitality sector. Stay away from patrons. And please, stay away from Latin America, because wherever you birds flock, you destroy and inflate cost of living to the moon. They came to SoBe, flipped condos like crazy, inflated the local cost of living, treated patrons like crap, and now left to destroy Ft Lauderdale. It happens all the time. San Francisco is bankrupt, so is LA, and surprise surprise two of the most unaffordable places to live. Now they've flocked to destroy San Diego, too. Just like they did to the Marais in Paris. No sympathy from me. BTW, why do you have to travel in bands like a circus of gypsys?
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Jack Brown 02/02/2010 6:31:00 PM
Natalie Oniel once again your cease to amaze me. If you are going to fill your story with a bunch a crap at least fact check the items that you get from the police departmnet. i pulled the reports you sepak of and you dont even get that write. For a CORRECT VERSION of what is going own check out the WIRE WEEKLY they wrote a rebuttal to this unfactual and ridiculous story by the NEw Times
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Jason 01/31/2010 7:35:00 PM
This article was good but failed to try to identify who the bashers are, why they're bashing, etc. It hinted at the hip-hop community, but nothing more than hints.
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D . L. 01/31/2010 7:19:00 AM
Miami Beach used to be a fun place to be. It had beauty, charm, class and style.
Now it's just plain ghetto.
What happened?
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Peace by Jesus 01/27/2010 5:23:00 AM
I remembering being in South Beach in 95, where God, in a very evident manner, had sent us to offering salvation thru Jesus. And compared to Massachusetts, the people were more respectful.
While i certainly disagree with homosexualiy and its lifestyle, and it is wrong (see peacebyjesus,com) Jesus came to save sinners, not destroy them. May all know the salvation that He purchased with His own blood, as the Father sent the Son to be the savior of the world. Praise the Lord.
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Queenie 01/23/2010 1:38:00 AM
To 'anon' from Miami: I think you're begging the question, if you know what that means, God knows, maybe you do. This is not statistics 101, anon. In very real terms and not in statistical indicators, the comparison between the real number of murders in Miami and the number in that quaint strip-mall we all know, and love, as Fort Lauderdale, is more pertinent. Natalie O'neill, golden girl of classified-ad journalism and star investigative reporter for this dubious, inglorious rag, is not comparing New York to Miami, of course. For that matter, I personally couldn't give rat's behind about New York, an utter abomination any way you look at it in terms of corruption and violent crime. Perhaps you should direct your well meaning caveat hack writer Natalie O'neill, who quite evidently does not seem to know the difference between her butt and a hole in the wall, just to see what she has to say if anything for her pulp writing. Better yet - save your time and don't even bother. Try to enjoy the beach and South Florida, including Fort Lauderdale, in spite of all the bucketloads of outragesou bullshit that you come across in these incredibly amusing gutter flyers!
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Robert 01/22/2010 11:51:00 PM
So true. I never go to South Beach anymore. It is the new Hip Hop playground now and everyone knows that these new "residents" of South Beach are not a peaceful or respectful bunch. Especially to gay people.
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Just the Truth 01/22/2010 8:26:00 PM
I never felt comfortable in SOBE...I was there in the late 70's, mid 80's, throughout the 90's and 2000's. I never found it to be a desirable city.
As a South Florida resident who grew up here, I have seen the very worst and the very best in the area, and I am still not impressed with SOBE. I was harrased, attacked and ran into the worst of humankind possible there. I found the majority of people, both gay and straight alike to have no morals, values or substance. They seemed apathetic, flaky and empty, and all they cared about was their own physical stimulation.
Regardless of all the glitter and feathers these die-hard Southbeachers brag about, I prefer Fort Lauderdale so much more. Here we have a lot more diversity in our gay culture, and not just the "show" people who stood around in SOBE with their noses up in the air, some muscles escaping their scrawny sickly bodies, exuberant attire, high hair, bad, overly tanned skins, painted faces, plucked eyebrows, implants and injections galore, girly poses, bitchy facial expressions, and who thought they were so much better than the rest of the world.
From all the sex parties and drugs, many of these individuals are now gone, destitute, on disability or back home being taken care of by their families.
Sure, we have gotten a lot of those South Beach flakes, but we also have a great variety of serious, hard-working respectable gay people in FTL/WM who care about their community, and who are so much more manly, sexy, wholesome, educated and interesting. That is something South Beach always lacked. Fort Lauderdale is not just a party scene city, but a truer city with much more to offer. We truly are building a real and more sustainable gay community.
All these pro Southbeachers are in essence contradicting themselves in their arguments. The end result, this worthless culture that lacked any goodness hung itself by becoming way too arrogant for their own good. Just the Truth!
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anon 01/22/2010 8:04:00 PM
Queenie, when doing your research remember that Miami Beach from 1st to 90th Street has a population of 87,000. NYC has a population of over 8 million.
More info to back up the thug theory:
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/southflorida/story/1439043.html
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Alex 01/22/2010 6:15:00 AM
You want to live in a real city? Move to NYC! This place is pure garbage, along with the people.
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Miguel A. Alarcon 01/22/2010 1:44:00 AM
Well I think that every community has the right to do as long as they do not do harm, it seems that South Beach is going to another direction; and it seems that Ft. Lauderdale too is going to another direction.
Their is no use for crimes like these so let them do what they do as long as they don't bother you.
At least if someday Canada gains better laws for gays then they might just burn the US flag if Canada has better rights someday in the future as American gays migrant into American soil who knows lets see what happend if Canada have better gay rights.
After all I am born here in the US I do not mind who is around me gay or not as long as they don't bug me.
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Queenie 01/22/2010 1:06:00 AM
Murders in Miami Beach:
1999- 10
2000- 6
2001- 6
2002- 7
2003- 6
2004- 8
2005- 3
2006- 4
2007- 4
2008- 6
2009- unavailable, but very far from the 71 murders in Fort Lauderdale in 2009.
Murders in Fort Lauderdale:
1999- 22
2000- 13
2001- 29
2002- 12
2003- 18
2004- 15
2005- 15
2006- 21
2007- 25
2008- 22
2009- 71 murders in Ft. Lauderdale in 2009 only
In New York City, in 2009 there were 10 murders every week..
See the revealing numbers:
New York City- 461 total murders (5.51 per 100,000 people)
Los Angeles- 308 total murders (8.03 per 100,000 people)
Chicago- 459 total murders (16.08 per 100,000 people)
Houston- 281 total murders (12.53 per 100,000 people)
Phoenix- N/A
Philadelphia- 302 total murders (19.61 per 100,000 people)
San Antonio- 96 total murders (7.1 per 100,000 people)
Dallas- 218 total murders (17.03 per 100,000 people)
San Diego- 39 total murders (3.05 per 100,000 people)
San Jose- 27 total murders (2.85 per 100,000 people)
Detroit- N/A
San Francisco- 45 total murders (5.56 per 100,000 people)
Jacksonville- 104 total murders (12.87 per 100,000 people)
Indianapolis- 100 total murders (12.52 per 100,000 people)
Austin- 23 total murders (3.04 per 100,000 people)
Columbus- 83 total murders (10.99 per 100,000 people)
Fort Worth- N/A
Charlotte- 55 total muders (8.00 per 100,000 people)
Memphis- 135 total murders (20.15 per 100,000 people)
Baltimore- 238 total murders (37.36 per 100,000 people)
Boston- 49 total murders (7.89 per 100,000 people)
El Paso- 13 total murders (2.12 per 100,000 people)
Milwaukee- 72 total murders (11.96 per 100,000 people)
Denver- N/A
Seattle- 20 total murders (3.34 per 100,000 people)
Nashville- N/A
Washington DC- 138 total murders (23 per 100,000 people)
Las Vegas- N/A
Portland- 21 total murders (3.77 per 100,000 people)
Louisville- 71 total murders IN METRO AREA (9.94 per 100,000 people METRO)
Oklahoma City- N/A
Tucson- N/A
Atlanta- 91 total murders (16.91 per 100,000 people)
Albuquerque- 73 total murders (11.49 per 100,000 people)
(Read more: http://www.city-data.com/forum/city-vs-city/856004-city-murder-rates-2009-a-2.html#ixzz0dHNYr1Cq)
Well, I guess at this rate all gays, indeed all citizenz and legal residents of the US, should start making preparations to leave this somewhat unfriendly country of ours. It seems Natalie's hard at work preparing her next investigative article for New Times as we speak. Never fear, Natalie's here!
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yup 01/21/2010 10:23:00 PM
and another one bites the dust...
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/breaking-news/story/1437624.html?pageNum=3&&mi_pluck_action=page_nav#Comments_Container
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Queenie (alias Reina and I'm n 01/21/2010 9:54:00 AM
If you think for one minute that there's more police patrolling in South Beach as a result of this dinky, preposterous, pseudo article then they probably ought to be out looking for you, really, not for the bad guys. Officer, please apprehend that poor man with the dog before he hurts himself somehow!!! For Chris'sake, JC, give me a break.
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JC 01/21/2010 6:31:00 AM
Obviously this article has "stirred up the masses" and some of the posts here represent the rampant ignorance, intolerance and just plain hatred still out there. Anyways, maybe becuase of this article, I was walking my dog AT South Beach this afternoon and definitely noticed an increase of police paroling. I saw a rather high amount of police cars driving all around and also going through the many alley ways around South Beach. Maybe this might be the only positive thing this article has brought BUT it has severely damaged the gay tourism trade. I read this article on "Yahoo" for God's sake! Do you know how many millions of people read Yahoo news!
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David Ostler 01/19/2010 8:31:00 PM
years of active ministry. I am celibate and hardworking and healthy and loving and faithful. I am also a gay man. Why is this wrong?
A Gay Priest Speaks Out
The Vatican, homosexuals & holy orders
Rev. David Ostler
Sometime in the next few months, the Vatican will issue a much-anticipated document addressing the issue of whether gay men can be ordained priests. The policy is being written by the Congregation for Catholic Education in preparation for the upcoming Vatican's apostolic visitation of seminaries in the United States, the in-depth review that is part of the Vatican's response to the sexual-abuse crisis.
Exactly what Rome will say is unclear. Some observers predict an outright ban on admitting homosexuals to seminaries and religious orders; others foresee less drastic restrictions. No one, however, expects the Vatican to issue a warm welcome to gay men who feel called to the priesthood. But while banning or severely restricting gay men in orders would surely delight those U.S. Catholics who blame gay priests for the sexual-abuse crisis or have been railing against the "gay subculture" in the clergy, to a gay priest like myself, the imminent release of this document looms like terrible, if not entirely unexpected, news from the doctor.
It is also represents a serious moral error.
Few doubt that the impetus behind the Vatican's proposed statement is the sexual-abuse crisis that has convulsed the Catholic Church in America for the past three years. And if American Catholics took note that the crimes overwhelmingly concerned priests preying on young boys and adolescent males, those in Rome drew unwarranted deductions from those facts, prompting some Vatican officials to take aim at all homosexuals in the priesthood. As Vatican spokesman Joaqui�n Navarro-Valls said in March 2002, "People with these inclinations just cannot be ordained".
Yet many men with such "inclinations" are already ordained. To be sure, no reliable data exist about the number of gay priests in the United States, and estimates vary widely. Many bishops and religious superiors, who are either embarrassed by the presence of gay priests under their jurisdiction or who deny their existence, are understandably skittish about conducting research that would confirm the presence of homosexual priests in the church. (My completely anecdotal impression is that probably 25 percent of priests are homosexual.) Still, even if research were conducted, it is unlikely that gay priests would feel comfortable participating. Frank answers might jeopardize their ministries, especially since some bishops seem to equate homosexuality with pedophilia. "We feel a person who is homosexual-oriented is not a suitable candidate for the priesthood, even if he had never committed any homosexual act", said Cardinal Anthony Bevilacqua, archbishop of Philadelphia, in April 2002.
In addition to the lack of data, a strict code of silence concerning homosexual priests has been imposed. Bishops and religious superiors have forbidden many priests from speaking, writing, or preaching about their homosexuality. (This is the reason I am using a pseudonym for this article: I have been instructed not to speak publicly about my sexual identity.) Thus gay priests like myself are caught in a double bind. If we speak the truth and discuss freely our existence in the church, and, more important, our experience of leading fulfilling lives as celibate men, we will be censured or removed from ministry. If we remain silent, though, we guarantee that the positive example of the celibate gay priest will remain hidden. Voiceless, the gay priest cannot defend himself within the church. Stereotyped, he cannot escape the suspicions of society at large.
Yet on this subject, as in so many other areas, the church needs to embrace more transparency, not more silence. For celibate gay priests, like all of God's people, have an important story to tell.
To take but one example, I have often wanted to remind my parishioners that media coverage of the sexual-abuse crisis portraying all gay priests as abusers was inaccurate and unjust. But I could not offer convincing arguments or testimony without admitting that I knew gay priests or happened to be one myself. This is all the more frustrating because, while too many Catholic commentators equate "gay priest" with "sexually active", the overwhelming majority of gay priests, in my own experience, are faithful to their promise to be celibate, and lead lives of healthy service to the church and the community at large. Moreover, despite some predictable misunderstandings and insecurities on all sides, homosexual and heterosexual priests work comfortably together.
Further, it is simply a calumny to say that gay priests are necessarily sexually active, or worse, that they are pedophiles. There are thousands of devoted priests ministering today who are gay and have found healthy ways of living celibately. The uncharitable accusations about the "gay subculture" in the priesthood stems primarily from the stereotype of the gay person as utterly incapable of keeping a vow of chastity or promise of celibacy. That is a falsehood. Moreover, the refusal of the hierarchy to welcome healthy, celibate gay priests as role models perpetuates that falsehood. In such an environment, where celibate gay priests are invisible, the only public examples of gay priests are, by default, notorious pedophiles. Is it any wonder, then, that Rome is busy preparing this new document?
This kind of hypocrisy makes it impossible for American Catholics, let alone the Vatican, to come to a more accurate view of the lives and ministry of gay priests. This, in turn, entails a great spiritual loss.
If the Incarnation shows us anything, it is that God loves us in our humanity, even in our weakness, as St. Paul says-perhaps especially in our weakness. We all have a need to see ourselves as loved by God as we are, even in those parts of ourselves that embarrass or sadden us. Perhaps we think ourselves too plain, too unintelligent, too untalented, or too unsuccessful to warrant God's love. But God's love is always far greater than we can imagine, and embraces our entire selves. In my own life, one of the most profound experiences of God's love came when, after many years, I finally accepted that I could not change myself into a straight man: I was gay and that was simply the way God had created me. Encountering God's love as I am was a transforming experience, one that I have wanted to share with parishioners not as an example of any personal sexual liberation, but as a sign of God's infinite, and always surprising, understanding. Does this basic acceptance of God's love seem like a commonplace sentiment? For most straight men and women, yes. But for gay people, it can be a profoundly difficult proposition to come to believe.
I have long hoped to testify before my parish to this foundational experience of God's love in my life, but I am of course forbidden to do so. And when a minister of the Word cannot publicly proclaim the freedom that the Word brings to his own life, it is a real loss for a community of faith.
My own path to the priesthood is similar to that of many gay men. In the American Catholic milieu in which I was raised, the pressures against coming to terms with my sexual identity were overwhelming [see Valerie Sayers, page 36].
Growing up, I told no one that I was gay. Entering the seminary in my twenties, I was, as a gay man, fearful of not receiving eventual permission for ordination, so in the initial interviews, questionnaires, and psychological tests required of applicants, I denied my homosexuality. (Later I sought forgiveness for this in the confessional.)
Eventually, though, I came to feel secure enough to reveal this facet of myself to my superiors. Doing so seemed a deepening of my original call, an invitation to spiritual growth, and a way to allow God to love me as I am. Further, I realized that my decades spent fearing rejection and feeling marginalized had fostered within me a deep love for the materially poor of this world, who are marginalized and rejected in far worse ways.
Fortunately, and to my surprise, my honesty was welcomed by my superiors and my fellow seminarians. Many conversations about sexuality followed-with seminary rectors, spiritual directors, other seminarians and priests, as well as with psychologists and pastoral counselors. Over the years, my growing understanding of who I was helped me live a life of celibacy with more honesty and comfort. Priestly celibacy, of course, is not easy. Making this total offering to God requires honesty, patience, and sacrifice. It also requires the willingness to engage in an honest and open discussion of one's sexuality, something a Vatican ban on homosexual priests would make impossible.
Few doubt that priestly celibacy and chastity within religious communities have long appealed to gay men and lesbians. Although the concept of homosexuality is a relatively new one, the phenomenon is not. Throughout the history of the church, homosexual men and women have found the priesthood and religious life both a refuge and a fulfilling way of life. As Richard John Neuhaus noted (First Things, June-July 2002): "It would seem more than likely that, in centuries past, some priests who have been canonized as saints would meet today's criteria as having a homosexual orientation". For many Catholics, the only surprising thing about gay priests is that we are still thought to be a source of shame whose existence must be kept secret.
If Rome bars homosexuals from the priesthood, many diocesan seminaries and formation houses for religious orders will undoubtedly lose good men during a time of drastically reduced vocations, while gay men already in orders will be further demoralized. There are other risks. Some priests, both straight and gay, hope that Vatican instructions dictating punitive steps against gay seminarians may be ignored or circumvented by sympathetic seminary rectors and novice directors. But subterfuge will only contribute to an ecclesial culture of hypocrisy. Will religious superiors encourage those to be ordained to practice deception in preparation for the sacrament of holy orders? Will some candidates simply refuse to discuss their homosexuality, closing themselves off to a healthy integration of their sexuality and thus laying the groundwork for spiritual inauthenticity-or worse?
Some have suggested that the Vatican may simply ask gay men to affirm that they have never been sexually active, or sign a document asserting their adherence to the church's teaching on homosexuality and rejection of the "gay lifestyle", or pledge never to discuss publicly their experience as gay men. Such restrictions can only be seen as tacit acceptance of the stereotype that homosexuals are inherently less psychologically healthy than heterosexuals-less capable of living celibately, less trustworthy, less valuable as members of the clergy, and, in general, less valuable as human beings. Restrictions would therefore represent an unjust discrimination against gay men. And as the Catechism instructs, concerning gays and lesbians, "They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in this regard should be avoided". (2358).
Many years ago I felt the first stirring of a vocation to the priesthood. It was an enormous gift in the order of grace. I believe the priesthood is the vocation for which I have been born, and this belief has been confirmed again and again over my
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David Ostler 01/19/2010 8:31:00 PM
years of active ministry. I am celibate and hardworking and healthy and loving and faithful. I am also a gay man. Why is this wrong?
A Gay Priest Speaks Out
The Vatican, homosexuals & holy orders
Rev. David Ostler
Sometime in the next few months, the Vatican will issue a much-anticipated document addressing the issue of whether gay men can be ordained priests. The policy is being written by the Congregation for Catholic Education in preparation for the upcoming Vatican's apostolic visitation of seminaries in the United States, the in-depth review that is part of the Vatican's response to the sexual-abuse crisis.
Exactly what Rome will say is unclear. Some observers predict an outright ban on admitting homosexuals to seminaries and religious orders; others foresee less drastic restrictions. No one, however, expects the Vatican to issue a warm welcome to gay men who feel called to the priesthood. But while banning or severely restricting gay men in orders would surely delight those U.S. Catholics who blame gay priests for the sexual-abuse crisis or have been railing against the "gay subculture" in the clergy, to a gay priest like myself, the imminent release of this document looms like terrible, if not entirely unexpected, news from the doctor.
It is also represents a serious moral error.
Few doubt that the impetus behind the Vatican's proposed statement is the sexual-abuse crisis that has convulsed the Catholic Church in America for the past three years. And if American Catholics took note that the crimes overwhelmingly concerned priests preying on young boys and adolescent males, those in Rome drew unwarranted deductions from those facts, prompting some Vatican officials to take aim at all homosexuals in the priesthood. As Vatican spokesman Joaqui�n Navarro-Valls said in March 2002, "People with these inclinations just cannot be ordained".
Yet many men with such "inclinations" are already ordained. To be sure, no reliable data exist about the number of gay priests in the United States, and estimates vary widely. Many bishops and religious superiors, who are either embarrassed by the presence of gay priests under their jurisdiction or who deny their existence, are understandably skittish about conducting research that would confirm the presence of homosexual priests in the church. (My completely anecdotal impression is that probably 25 percent of priests are homosexual.) Still, even if research were conducted, it is unlikely that gay priests would feel comfortable participating. Frank answers might jeopardize their ministries, especially since some bishops seem to equate homosexuality with pedophilia. "We feel a person who is homosexual-oriented is not a suitable candidate for the priesthood, even if he had never committed any homosexual act", said Cardinal Anthony Bevilacqua, archbishop of Philadelphia, in April 2002.
In addition to the lack of data, a strict code of silence concerning homosexual priests has been imposed. Bishops and religious superiors have forbidden many priests from speaking, writing, or preaching about their homosexuality. (This is the reason I am using a pseudonym for this article: I have been instructed not to speak publicly about my sexual identity.) Thus gay priests like myself are caught in a double bind. If we speak the truth and discuss freely our existence in the church, and, more important, our experience of leading fulfilling lives as celibate men, we will be censured or removed from ministry. If we remain silent, though, we guarantee that the positive example of the celibate gay priest will remain hidden. Voiceless, the gay priest cannot defend himself within the church. Stereotyped, he cannot escape the suspicions of society at large.
Yet on this subject, as in so many other areas, the church needs to embrace more transparency, not more silence. For celibate gay priests, like all of God's people, have an important story to tell.
To take but one example, I have often wanted to remind my parishioners that media coverage of the sexual-abuse crisis portraying all gay priests as abusers was inaccurate and unjust. But I could not offer convincing arguments or testimony without admitting that I knew gay priests or happened to be one myself. This is all the more frustrating because, while too many Catholic commentators equate "gay priest" with "sexually active", the overwhelming majority of gay priests, in my own experience, are faithful to their promise to be celibate, and lead lives of healthy service to the church and the community at large. Moreover, despite some predictable misunderstandings and insecurities on all sides, homosexual and heterosexual priests work comfortably together.
Further, it is simply a calumny to say that gay priests are necessarily sexually active, or worse, that they are pedophiles. There are thousands of devoted priests ministering today who are gay and have found healthy ways of living celibately. The uncharitable accusations about the "gay subculture" in the priesthood stems primarily from the stereotype of the gay person as utterly incapable of keeping a vow of chastity or promise of celibacy. That is a falsehood. Moreover, the refusal of the hierarchy to welcome healthy, celibate gay priests as role models perpetuates that falsehood. In such an environment, where celibate gay priests are invisible, the only public examples of gay priests are, by default, notorious pedophiles. Is it any wonder, then, that Rome is busy preparing this new document?
This kind of hypocrisy makes it impossible for American Catholics, let alone the Vatican, to come to a more accurate view of the lives and ministry of gay priests. This, in turn, entails a great spiritual loss.
If the Incarnation shows us anything, it is that God loves us in our humanity, even in our weakness, as St. Paul says-perhaps especially in our weakness. We all have a need to see ourselves as loved by God as we are, even in those parts of ourselves that embarrass or sadden us. Perhaps we think ourselves too plain, too unintelligent, too untalented, or too unsuccessful to warrant God's love. But God's love is always far greater than we can imagine, and embraces our entire selves. In my own life, one of the most profound experiences of God's love came when, after many years, I finally accepted that I could not change myself into a straight man: I was gay and that was simply the way God had created me. Encountering God's love as I am was a transforming experience, one that I have wanted to share with parishioners not as an example of any personal sexual liberation, but as a sign of God's infinite, and always surprising, understanding. Does this basic acceptance of God's love seem like a commonplace sentiment? For most straight men and women, yes. But for gay people, it can be a profoundly difficult proposition to come to believe.
I have long hoped to testify before my parish to this foundational experience of God's love in my life, but I am of course forbidden to do so. And when a minister of the Word cannot publicly proclaim the freedom that the Word brings to his own life, it is a real loss for a community of faith.
My own path to the priesthood is similar to that of many gay men. In the American Catholic milieu in which I was raised, the pressures against coming to terms with my sexual identity were overwhelming [see Valerie Sayers, page 36].
Growing up, I told no one that I was gay. Entering the seminary in my twenties, I was, as a gay man, fearful of not receiving eventual permission for ordination, so in the initial interviews, questionnaires, and psychological tests required of applicants, I denied my homosexuality. (Later I sought forgiveness for this in the confessional.)
Eventually, though, I came to feel secure enough to reveal this facet of myself to my superiors. Doing so seemed a deepening of my original call, an invitation to spiritual growth, and a way to allow God to love me as I am. Further, I realized that my decades spent fearing rejection and feeling marginalized had fostered within me a deep love for the materially poor of this world, who are marginalized and rejected in far worse ways.
Fortunately, and to my surprise, my honesty was welcomed by my superiors and my fellow seminarians. Many conversations about sexuality followed-with seminary rectors, spiritual directors, other seminarians and priests, as well as with psychologists and pastoral counselors. Over the years, my growing understanding of who I was helped me live a life of celibacy with more honesty and comfort. Priestly celibacy, of course, is not easy. Making this total offering to God requires honesty, patience, and sacrifice. It also requires the willingness to engage in an honest and open discussion of one's sexuality, something a Vatican ban on homosexual priests would make impossible.
Few doubt that priestly celibacy and chastity within religious communities have long appealed to gay men and lesbians. Although the concept of homosexuality is a relatively new one, the phenomenon is not. Throughout the history of the church, homosexual men and women have found the priesthood and religious life both a refuge and a fulfilling way of life. As Richard John Neuhaus noted (First Things, June-July 2002): "It would seem more than likely that, in centuries past, some priests who have been canonized as saints would meet today's criteria as having a homosexual orientation". For many Catholics, the only surprising thing about gay priests is that we are still thought to be a source of shame whose existence must be kept secret.
If Rome bars homosexuals from the priesthood, many diocesan seminaries and formation houses for religious orders will undoubtedly lose good men during a time of drastically reduced vocations, while gay men already in orders will be further demoralized. There are other risks. Some priests, both straight and gay, hope that Vatican instructions dictating punitive steps against gay seminarians may be ignored or circumvented by sympathetic seminary rectors and novice directors. But subterfuge will only contribute to an ecclesial culture of hypocrisy. Will religious superiors encourage those to be ordained to practice deception in preparation for the sacrament of holy orders? Will some candidates simply refuse to discuss their homosexuality, closing themselves off to a healthy integration of their sexuality and thus laying the groundwork for spiritual inauthenticity-or worse?
Some have suggested that the Vatican may simply ask gay men to affirm that they have never been sexually active, or sign a document asserting their adherence to the church's teaching on homosexuality and rejection of the "gay lifestyle", or pledge never to discuss publicly their experience as gay men. Such restrictions can only be seen as tacit acceptance of the stereotype that homosexuals are inherently less psychologically healthy than heterosexuals-less capable of living celibately, less trustworthy, less valuable as members of the clergy, and, in general, less valuable as human beings. Restrictions would therefore represent an unjust discrimination against gay men. And as the Catechism instructs, concerning gays and lesbians, "They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in this regard should be avoided". (2358).
Many years ago I felt the first stirring of a vocation to the priesthood. It was an enormous gift in the order of grace. I believe the priesthood is the vocation for which I have been born, and this belief has been confirmed again and again over my
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Brad 01/19/2010 10:38:00 AM
This article is wildly sensationalized. The claim that gays are "leaving in droves" is absurd. It seems as if the author talked mostly with drag queen Shelly Novak and then sought out only negative information to support her preconceived notion. South Beach has a vibrant and active LGBT community, and continues to attract thousands of LGBT tourist and visitors each year. Gay people are everywhere. Reports of the death of gay South Beach are greatly exaggerated.
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Sasha 01/19/2010 6:19:00 AM
I must say that for the past 2 years I have argued that gays have been flocking South Beach for Ft. Lauderdale... I used to grow up between the South Miami and Miami Beach communities (my parents were divorced). I am now an adult and I am a lesbian who works on Miami Beach but choses to live in the suburbs with "real miami people". Miami Beach was always an escape from the norm; you had the freaks, clubs, bars, beach, bums, gays, jews and old people. But Miami Beach was seen at one point as a big rainbow and unfortunetly it is not as animated as it used to be. I blame Hip Hop. South Beach is no longer a safe place to be walking around at night, and the hate crimes are ridiculous. It's really sad to see a once friendly, euphoric, free-spirited South Beach become a prison yard for hip hop tourists. But its all about $$$$ and if dey got the flow to spend we be invitin them all up in our sh*t. Very Sad
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Charlie 01/18/2010 8:04:00 PM
I'm a gay male 20-something in South Beach, and there's no way my friends or I would EVER move to such an ugly place like Ft Lauderdale. Miami Beach is a real city, Ft Lauderdale is a strip mall and parking lot.
Ewe.
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Glenn61 01/17/2010 9:20:00 PM
RE: Comment by Queenie on Jan 17th, 2010, 10:49 am
Oh my...! such a hurtful comment from a fag named Queenie....LOL
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Queenie 01/17/2010 8:49:00 PM
To Glennda from N. Miami: if you were a man you would duke it out with the so-called "thugs". But then again, Glennda, that's only if. What you need is a ticket to ride along with Natalie on the same bus to nowhere in particular.
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Glenn61 01/17/2010 6:40:00 PM
P.S.,,,just to clarify.
I'm not bagging on the Black folks with class, my nigger comments are directed toward the Thugs and the culture of violence they promote.
A culture were Whiggers and Latino thugs like to congregate as well, but the "minority" is now the majority there.
And the Red-Neck from Nebraska may feel ill toward the homo-sexuals to, but the reactionary violence just doesn't seem to be there like with the Blacks.
Because,,,let's face it,,,,Red-Necks are out of their environment on SoBe.
This is just my analogy of the situation But don't take my word for it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ui6-Wc0PDc4
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Glenn61 01/17/2010 6:06:00 PM
The gays can blame themselves and the city of Miami Beach for the hostile atmosphere in SoBe.
Hosting events like Hip-Hop Memorial day week end and catering to the vile Negro "rap" sub-culture is what changed SoBe from a Gay friendly atmosphere to a more primitive , testosterone driven, culture of violence and aggression.
So, Hello loud mouthed, stupid, arrogant niggers,,,good bye nice little queers.
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Queenie 01/17/2010 8:52:00 AM
Shit the name's Natalie...WTF.
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Queenie 01/17/2010 8:35:00 AM
Will she leave?
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Queenie 01/17/2010 8:26:00 AM
A dopey article by an evidently misinformed hack. What else can you expect from a rag like this! Hey, let's buy Jennifer a non-refundable one-way ticket to Ft. Laud, and consider it a very positive issue after all. Go Jenny!
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James 01/17/2010 5:44:00 AM
Where are the MBPD, what happened to their non tollerance for hate crimes? Why is it so scary to walk down Washington Avenue? They need to get out of their cars and they each have either an marked or unmarked police car and do their jobs, protect the tax paying citizens of Miami Beach!!
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Bill 01/17/2010 2:53:00 AM
I agree with Frank who said,
"Every community needs to fight hate crimes and both Miami Beach and Fort Lauderdale have been victims of this recent horrific increase in the incidence of attacks. But let's not attack each other. Both communities need to work together and speak out in one voice against these crimes."
South Beach has been a great place for me and my lover to live for the last ten years. We enjoy the diversity, love the convenience of walking everywhere and have friends both gay and straight.
I should also mention our wonderful Miami beach Mayor, Matti Bower, who is an ardent supporter of the gay community and has shown her support by starting A Gay Business Association and by bringing a fabulous Gay Parade to South Beach. We will have that great parade again this April. I hope everyone will come down and enjoy our community!
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Charles Poitras 01/17/2010 1:20:00 AM
Re: gays leaving South Beach
I'm gay guy who's lived on South Beach since '96. I'm not going anywhere. Yes, the gay stuff has been diluted but it is still a nice place to live. You don't need a lot of bars, you need a few good bars. I have never needed a car. That is a greener lifestyle that attracts more than just me. Wilton Manors is nice but it doesn't have the same amount of international tourists that I bump into at Twist. It is easier to practice my Spanish here. It�s bullshit that anyone has ever been assaulted because they were walking out of a gay bar or because they dress flamboyantly or because they lisp, but majority of us lispers and flamers have not had a problem. I missed last year�s gay pride but rest assured I will not miss it this year. Everyone gave it rave reviews. We can focus on the guys who've relocated to Lauderdale, but let's not forget to also talk to those of us who are still here. Granted, I'm not trying to make my living or even my social life in drag like Shelly and Daisy, but we still have a damn good time here.
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01/17/2010 1:06:00 AM
I believe this article to be true to some extent. South Beach is not seeing a mass exodus of its gay population, but is experiencing a diversification in its residents. Which I believe to be a good thing� The sad part of this story is reading the comments left in its path. For people to be racists and belligerent about an issue like this with no qualms is sad. You think you would expect from people who live in South Florida, with its mixed racial ethnicities, to have some tolerance for other minority groups. I believe in the old adage if you have nothing good to say, then don�t say anything at all.
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Rich 01/17/2010 12:44:00 AM
I am a straight man, with a gay mother and brother. I say I was forced into acceptance, because you can't hate where you come from, it will only drive you crazy. I understand the struggles of the glbt community. I understand the confusion, and misguidance that fuels the hate of those outside the community. I have friends on both sides, and I feel that the violence is wrong and out of control. A part of the hip hop side of things, I have friends that have walked sobe yelling out 'fag', simulating gunshots. I have done what I can to show how this behavior does nothing and is harmful. People, if it doesn't effect you, live and let live. We all have one go at this life. Leave people alone. I pray for all of you.
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Real Miamiam 01/16/2010 10:42:00 PM
Thank you New Times. It was about time for some one to bring this issue up !!!
Other cities like New York and Chicago have been able to keep Gay hoods around, and everyone gays, straits can co exist.
why are city officials so blind about Miami's gay community? Maybe because we do not come together like we should!!! If all the gay community will unity, and I am not talking only about the Sobe , kendal coral gables, el portal ,, etc...maybe we could accomplish some respect...
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Rob 01/16/2010 7:15:00 PM
In a world where all we see is violence and hate, we live in a country that has given us hope for peace, we should all take a closer look at ourselves and stop the hate for humanity. This type of violence will stop.
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Mr,G 01/16/2010 10:30:00 AM
I bet people who beat up gays for no reason suck the best dick
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Brian B. 01/16/2010 9:28:00 AM
Hmmmm, Omnipotent. Abhorrent lifestyles justifiably being met with violence because activities associated with them cause preventable and lethal disease... Please be advised that in some places, heterosexual sexual transmission of HIV is greater than homosexual sexual transmission or drug use (e.g., Sub-Saharan Africa, the Caribbean, and China, please see http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,576828,00.html?sPage=fnc/health/sexualhealth and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIDS_pandemic). And what about the places where the transmission of HIV by heterosexual sex actually does lag that of transmission by homosexual sex like here in the US where roughly 44.5% of transmissions occur from homosexual sex and roughly 34.5% occur from heterosexual sex? Because heterosexual transmission accounts for roughly 10% fewer seroconversions, heterosexual persons who seroconvert are granted a reprieve from moral indignation and violence?
And how about other behaviors which foster disease and death, like overeating and smoking? Are you prepared to propose that violence against them is equally justifiable?
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Tammy Alvarez 01/16/2010 9:23:00 AM
Can you please, please, please...learn how to spell and use proper grammar and stop worrying about what other people do--gay, straight, or otherwise!!! You should be more concerned with looking like an illiterate idiot in public...
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Omnipotent 01/16/2010 7:50:00 AM
"on the corner of 14th Street and Collins Avenue in 1991 and began to throw decadent foam parties where naked men neck-deep in bubbles had anonymous sex. The club soon featured leather-clad go-go dancers, midget performers with pigs, and male strippers who pulled ribbons out of various orifices. "Back then, there was an edginess to South Beach," Delaplaine remembers. "It was a war zone."
There's no sign of grittiness these days."
Gritiness of sh*tiness? If heterosexual couples exhibited this behavior in public, it would draw the same ire. In your face male queerness is unwanted by the vast majority of Americans. It goes beyond religious morality to the issue of life and death itself. The insistence by gay men demanding acceptance of their abhorrent lifestyle will continue to be met with violence, as male gay behavior and shooting dope are the leading causes of a preventable and lethal disease that causes slow death for children, hemophiliacs, straight women, and health care workers.
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jeff 01/16/2010 7:28:00 AM
wow, 4 against 1, such fair odds? and so who's the real faggot? obviously the aggressors, but they're nothing that a ccw permit and s&w cant resolve.
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Brian B. 01/16/2010 7:11:00 AM
Right On, you wrote "The article may hurt city pride and the sensibilities [of those] who live there, but, the truth, when not to our liking, hurts. South Beach, I'm sorry to say, is over."
As a psychologist, I teach my students that it�s not so much what happens to them in life, but what they think about what happens to them that ultimately determines their reactions. Clearly your thoughts and perceptions about South Beach preclude you from feeling the same contentment I feel when we look at the same city. That�s your truth and it�s as legit as anyone�s. For me, I've never been happier than I have been waking up to Miami Beach mornings since moving here a little over 2 years ago. At almost every turn, I notice things that make me feel as grateful as one can feel to be able to live in a place like South Beach. Does every turn result in this reaction? Hell no, but it�s totally my choice which events and perceptions I will ascribe greater value. SoBe is hardly perfect and it really can�t compare to the way it was in the 1990s. But there�s still more than enough to fuel what I believe to be an enviable existence for me. To each, most definitely his own.
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marva lightbourne 01/15/2010 11:26:00 PM
"escape from south beach" article was interesting in that now the shift toward the ft. lauderdale area with gays people is more prevalent. and as time changes and certain clubs has "run it course." what was a staple club here in the north miami area was SUGARS, for so many years, alice ranned that club very well, and was well attended by predominately gay-black men. we are having a GAY REUNION PARTY ON FEB. 12TH FRI. AT THE MAHI SHRINER AUDITORUIM IN MIAMI to recognized the old time gay entertainers here in the miami area ( some are coming from out of town) we have to keep the movement going, and confront hatred/predujices toward G.L.B.T. at every opportunity that it raises it ugly head. M.L.CHAIRWOMEN OF CONCERNED CITIZENS COMMITT,INC. LIBERTY CITY. WWWCONCITCOMVPWEB.COM. 305-758-2292
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Jilson 01/15/2010 7:37:00 PM
There's no place like South Beach in Florida. It gets more and more fabulous every year. Sure some people prefer to drive to a strip mall to eat or go to a bar but South beach has everything in one place with people from all over the world. Where else can you go to the beach, dine out go to a bar for a drink, people watch, visit a museum, shop, go to a movie and never get in back your car? If you say the mall, you really need to get a life!
Trash South Beach? Sounds like sour grapes to me!
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RightOn 01/15/2010 6:52:00 PM
Right on. The article may hurt city pride and the sensibilities who live there, but, the truth, when not to our liking, hurts. South Beach, I'm sorry to say, is over.
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craig trent 01/15/2010 10:11:00 AM
really very poor research by the writer:
what used to be Barrio is now a falafel shop, not a doctors office. the doctors office is next door and has been there 20+ years.
the foam parties weren't at Warsaw, but rather Amnesia. Liquid was an upstairs club and located ABOVE what is now American Apparel, which used to be a Payless Shoe Store...
The apartment building that became the Versace Mansion was not "rent controlled"....rent control doesn't even exist in Miami!!!!
poor research and these inaccuracies indicate a bigger picture of making a story out to be what the writer wanted it to be, which was just a slam job on south beach!
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Frank 01/15/2010 6:39:00 AM
Escape from South Beach?? Natalie O�Neill has got to be kidding! She insinuates that gays are abandoning South Beach for the �safer� environment of Fort Lauderdale. Well, first off, crime statistics don�t bare her out.
Broward County (including Fort Lauderdale/Wilton Manors) ranks No. 1 statewide with 25 total hate crimes including 9 based upon sexual orientation."
Maybe the gays are running in the wrong direction!
South Beach has one Hip Hop weekend a year and we're labeled as a Hip Hop haven. That sounds pretty racist to me but I am not going to get into that here. Let�s just say that such a statement is simply not fair! Here in South Beach we have, just to name a few things off the top of my head: White Party (Gay) Winter Party (Gay) The fabulous Boat Show, Art Deco Weekend, the international Art Basel exhibition, Food and Wine Festival, Gay Film Festival, Jewish Film Festival, Gay Pride Parade, Black Film Festival, Italian Film Festival, Aqua Girl Weekend (Lesbian) and much, much more.
We have an exciting new symphony hall designed by world-renowned architect, Frank Gehry about to be completed just off Lincoln Road, a new beautiful new building on Lincoln Road designed by Herzog and DeMeuron the architects of the Birds Nest at the Winter Olympic in Beijing, gay bars that have been here for years including Twist, Score, and The Palace and several new ones including Azucar which just moved from Miami to 5th St and Jefferson Ave, Movi which is in the old Jeffrey's space on Michigan and several others.
We have a new Art Deco Welcome Center on Ocean Drive and South Pointe Park is entirely renovated and absolutely beautiful. It's full of families not thugs!
We have The Wolfsonian, The Bass, and The Jewish Museum. We also have the country's first nationally recognized 20th century federal historic district.
Of course we have, Ocean Drive, Espanola Way, Lincoln Road and one of the most beautiful beaches in the world!
If you live in or visit South Beach all of these things are in walking distance!!!
I think there's something else going on when people have to trash one community in order to build up their own. Fort Lauderdale is a nice place but I choose to live in South Beach. I don't understand all the South Beach bashing. There is a wonderful, diverse and active community here in South Beach. What�s one of the first places your house guests ask to see when they get in town? I bet it's South beach more often than not!
Every community needs to fight hate crimes and both Miami Beach and Fort Lauderdale have been victims of this recent horrific increase in the incidence of attacks. But let's not attack each other. Both communities need to work together and speak out in one voice against these crimes.
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keywest 01/15/2010 5:06:00 AM
Good story to get the gay masses worked up, but, loose reporting. Maybe you did your research but the text has huge holes wherein fact is subjective.
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Jim 01/15/2010 2:08:00 AM
I am a gay man and have been to South Beach on many occasions in the past. I always had a good time. I have been there with straight friends with children and had a great time. Likewise, I have been there to "party" and have had a great time.
Last year, I wanted to go back with my partner for a relaxing vacation. I could not find one gay guesthouse on any website for South Beach! Is this true? Are there no longer gay owned or gay friendly places to stay? I inquired of friends, and was told the gay life "moved to Ft. Lauderdale.".....so, that is where we went. A quick internet search revealed 30+ gay owned or friendly places to stay. We loved Ft. Lauderdale too. So, it appears from my little experience that South Beach is not the gay destination that it once was. Or, at least the businesses are not advertising well enough to solicit my business.
Anyway, we did drive into South Beach to enjoy the beach one day. And, we drove in one night to take in the night life.
In my opinion, things have changed. The crowded gay beach was not as crowded. The huge night-clubs are no longer huge...and, fewer people were patronizing them.
From those I spoke with, the only time that South Beach is "gay happening" is during special events like White Party...otherwise, not so much.
I was not harassed at any point...but, I am of the stature that most do not mess with me. But, that did not keep me from feeling uncomfortable, and unsafe at several locales.
So, from that experience and from what others have said...I do not see myself returning to South Beach...unless with friends for an "event weekend"... when we are assured there will be a visible gay presence and comfort level of security.
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Alex 01/15/2010 1:08:00 AM
No matter what, Miami and specially South Beach is a great place if you are gay or not! Of course is not what it used to be,but the gay men here are some of the most beautiful of the world,wich you don't find in fort lauderdale...and the city is just stunning!
Unfortunatly like in any big city you have to be careful wher you go byyourself at night,but that could happen everywhere.
South Beach has changed but is one of the few places in the USA where you can walk holding hands or kissing your boyfriends if you want to and most people are very open minded,I lived here all my life so I know what I am saying.
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J 01/15/2010 1:07:00 AM
Gays built the beach. They made South Beach what it is today. If it weren't for the true gay visionaries that renewed South Beach it would still be a desolate, dangerous, drug ridden area. I remeber you couldn't go near South Beach because it was so scummy in the seventies. Unfortunately I foresee things coming full circle. The South Beach hey day is over. The "straights" won't keep it up because the novelty will wear off and it will just get more ghetto until it goes back to what it originally was in the seventies - a place for crack heads and welfare recipients.
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Danny F 01/14/2010 8:19:00 PM
My husband and I lived in the heart of South Beach for 5 years. We had a wonderful time and loved every minute. This year, we moved to Miami Shores. We never thought we'd leave the beach, but times and circumstances change. We do miss it, but don't rue our decision.
Oh, and of all our gay friends from the Beach that remained in Florida... Only 1 still lives there.
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anon 01/14/2010 7:35:00 PM
I lived in South Beach for 8 years (now loving life on the Upper Eastside). The main problem is the 'causeway crowd', not the residents. Idiots from Kendall that think they are thug. I'm sure drunk tourists are also to blame a small amount.
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Thetruth 01/14/2010 10:51:00 AM
This article is very missleading on many different points, the one I'm gonna talk about is the drag!! Daisy is and always will be popular and 2 of her gigs are here on the miami beach. Shelley has burned so many bridges and has never evolved as a drag queen that most people won't hire her unless it's a blast from the past event. The girls in Ftl are trying just as hard to get work as the girls in Miami, in fact girls from Ftl are driving down here constantly for work.
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doug 01/14/2010 10:00:00 AM
I used to vacation in South beach all the time but got tired of getting harassed coming home from the clubs or just walking down the streets. WHere are the cops? Oh yeah, they are harassing the gay guys on the beach at night while giving a free pass to opposite sex couples. I was there with my brother a year ago after the death of our father and we sat on the beach one night listening to the waves and remembering dad. these cops came along and physically and verbally accosted us for over 20 minutes. We were just sitting there in the sand talking and he's my brother for fucks sake. I'm gay but my brother isn't. We were so angry we packed up everything and drove back to Toronto and swore never to return to South Beach again. Go after the real criminals assholes. We did nothing wrong. If they are just trying to stop public sex from happening on the beach at night why give the straight couples a pass and hassle two guys who are just sitting there? I told my brother shit like that happens but he didn't believe it till it happened to the both of us. I miss South Beach but i'll never return and you can thank Miami Beach's finest for that.
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Eric 01/14/2010 8:39:00 AM
I find this article to be ridiculous and offensive to our city...
first of all i've seen many gay people be aggressive towards the straight trust me we can kick some ass... we need to stop acting like victims and show society how alike we really are.
Second SORRY ft lauderdale no matter how many gays move to your cities SoBe will always RULE!
Thirdly i have NEVER read any positive article on SoBe on the New Times maybe SoBe's not good enough for your magazine, all Sobe businesses should stop advertising with you magazine until more positive sories are written about our amazing GAY city.
Forthly maybe you should start getting your facts on Sobe from people that are more active in our city like Elaine Lancaster or Adora not other drag queens that are stuck in the 90's.
Thank you
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Edison Farrow 01/14/2010 8:16:00 AM
All of the facts in this article are INCORRECT!
I do not know where (or if) she did her research. However, none of the claims of reports anti-gay hate crimes in Miami-Dade are accurate.
The population of Miami-Dade county has continued to rise over the years. So has the GLBT population.
The Miami Herald reports that in Miami-Dade, there are "123,000 adults who identify as gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender".
I was called and interviewed for this article. But, I guess that my statements did not fit the sensationalism that they were looking for.
It is a shame that there are ANY hate crimes in our community. However, you should not take a few examples and create a ficticious report.
The Miami Herald's Steve Rothaus reports that "the total number of gay hate crimes reported in all of Miami Dade County: 4.
According to Florida�s latest annual hate crime statistics, Miami-Dade County (including Miami Beach) reported 18 hate crimes total, including 4 based upon sexual orientation.
Broward County (including Fort Lauderdale/Wilton Manors) ranks No. 1 statewide with 25 total hate crimes including 9 based upon sexual orientation."
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CountMeOut 01/14/2010 7:32:00 AM
Exhausted by its deteriorating quality of life, I fled South Beach in 2004, having lived through the gay renaissance and seen it go from the decline of the late 80s to its boom in the 90s. Today, it is such a congested, dirty, tourist trap. The deco buildings are still there, gorgeous as ever, thank God, but the quality of life is sooo bad. Few good jobs, streets that flood constantly, rowdy crowds, an arm and a leg for parking, constant congestion, a less-than-adequate mayor, I mean, the list can go on and on and on (God help that sandbar when a real hurricane hits the Beach. It will make Katrina look like a picnic).
Result? Gays and lesbians go to Fort Lauderdale and Wilton Manors, where there are many gay-owned and operated businesses, guesthouses, plenty of restaurants and clubs. Of course there are problems in that area as well. No place is perfect, but there is more of a sense of community, with something for everyone. South Beach is like the pretty girl who got really arrogant and everyone put up with her for a while because she was the life of the party. But in the end, we could see her warts and all, and got tired. Only a few delusional souls would believe otherwise. So this article is right on target.
The city commissioners will tell you they have done much to improve gay life, like bringing the gay pride parade back, or allowing for gay flags to be flown. But those are little gestures that have come too late. South Beach missed the boat. The mayor goes to gay clubs all the time and has cocktails. Good for her. BUT: the issues that affect us all, gay and straight, are still there mayor after mayor after mayor, and for being such a small geographical area, it is almost impossible to believe that an administration can not make it shine as it should, a clean, comfortable modern city that protects its citizens and offers opportunity to all of them; that takes care of its stray animals and homeless; that promotes conservation and the environment; that has a police force that knows how to deal with its various communities; that can provide affordable entertainment and housing to people other than rich folks who just come to visit and don't plant roots in the area and don't care about it.
It is sad. It is heartbreaking. So much potential squandered. Who will take the blame though? No one, as is usually is the case in South Florida. Glad thus to be out of there. The local media, like a little paper called "The Wire", only chronicle the life of the clubs and pretend nothing is happening while the city burns. The Miami Herald? No influence anymore. And New Times, once the best of its kind around, has also changed for the worst. Come on, really, Dan Renzi??? "The Real World: Miami" helped bring the trash down here, and Renzi's bitchy portrayal of himself was downright damaging to the image of gays across America.
The good days are not coming back, unfortunately. And some gay people may still find the place enticing, especially if they've never been ther before and they just left North Dakota. But for those of us who were present there, who were part of the real South Beach in its heyday, it's a travesty what has happened. Maybe this article will serve as a wake-up call to many people, in more ways than one.
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Tony 01/14/2010 6:47:00 AM
I've lived in Miami my whole life and lived in South Beach for about 7 years and i must say South Beach has changed, but not for the worst. We have an amazing Mayor (Mattie Bower) who is extremely gay friendly. I must say that I feel safer here than in any other big city. Sure in every big city where nightlife rules there are people who drink and maybe look for trouble.
I recently was gay bashed in NYC (Chelsea) a very gay friendly neighborhood, maybe a victim of being at the wrong place at the wrong time. Now I take a cab if its really late. Not only in NYC but anywhere. It's common sense and being street smart.
South Beach is still just as glamorous and as GAY FRIENDLY as it was in the 90's. With all due respect I feel that people who bash SoBe are usually those who may not be able to afford the increase in prices compared Ft lauderdale.
Those who left should move back. SoBe Loves you!!! =)
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Larry 01/14/2010 3:14:00 AM
Somehow I don't think George Washington spent the winter in Valley Forge to have stupid, low class, drug addicted thugs loitering on a street with his good name. It is a disgrace.
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beckw 01/14/2010 2:54:00 AM
Long gone are the days of the Copa.. Backstreet.. and now South Beach! What is happening here is so WRONG! Where is the LAW??? Is there any law at all??? These macho latinos and crazy hip hops need to be ARRESTED AND LOCKED UP FOR HATE CRIMES! Hello, Police?? ARe you listening? Or are you a part of the problem? Oh I forgot.. most "police" in Dade County are latinos.. hmmm.. I guess they wouldn't arrest a fellow latino, now would they? NO. They wouldn't. The Cubans stick together against the Americans. Haven't you heard? And as far as the police arresting a "brotha", well.. since America has been turned into an Obomination, that's not about to happen! You don't dare accuse or arrest an Obaminite.. they'll use the race card every time.. Don't look for any changes on South Beach anytime soon my friends.. unfortunately the HATE will continue... very sad.. Maybe we should get the cops down here from Wyoming.. you know, remember Matthew Shepard?! Same thing going on down here, except on a much larger scale.. we need some GOOD COPS TO PUT THESE ANIMALS DOWN.
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beckw 01/14/2010 2:43:00 AM
South Beach has turned into a toilet since the "hip hop" thug styles have taken over. South Beach was once a thriving lively happy place to visit, but not anymore. Just like America, its turning BLACK AND UGLY. There are few places for good decent people to go anymore.
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John 01/14/2010 2:09:00 AM
You failed to mention Andrew Cunanan was gay. He was not a pharmacist. He was a gay serial killer.
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JC 01/13/2010 11:41:00 PM
As a middle age gay man now, I remember Sobe in its hey-dey and I know many people gay and straight that lament "those days" but that is just the way things go. Remember Sobe was "undiscovered" back then and as fast as its obscurity as fast as its fame. It became the international party place, the place to be seen, the hottest of hotspots but everyone knows all this eventually ends. Sobe was uber-trendy then - the next "big thing" - but the allure of the "next big" things never last.
Its allure began vanishing thru the years, its cost of living there became astronomical then strastospherical which further pushed people out. Sobe had to become gentrified/commercialized in order to survive the hight costs of leases and floor space. The nightlife began to cater to the hip-hop crowd because of money and money only - they are the big spenders having lavishing parties, spending like crazy, booking solid hotel rooms. It was all about the money period. Also gay people began to disperse into the mainstream society (didn't we want this in the first place?)leaving behind "gay ghettos" all over the country. We must NOT tolerate hate and crime EVER but we must accept things change.
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davidMc 01/13/2010 11:01:00 PM
As usual, things of this nature turns into a brawl. One one hand I read the posters (many of whom are apparently white) who hate all gays, then there are gays who hate all breeders, then its the blacks fault. People, its the fault of ignorance.
Ignorance, bigotry, violence do not discriminate by class, race, creed. Enlightenment, peacefulness, understanding and acceptance also dont discriminate by class, race, creed. Bad is found everywhere good is found.
Its only the ignorant that make crass stereotypical statements like faggots, breeders, thugs, trailer park trash.
I'm a 55 year old black man who has long come to understand the above philosophy but moreso, that the discriminated and victimised should not discriminate or victimise any other minority. When you get down to it, we are all trying to live our lives.
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Kevin 01/13/2010 9:07:00 PM
This article is totally misleading and actually offensive. I actually moved from Ft lauderdale to South Beach and I am very happy. I feel sorry for the any person that gets attacked, but the reality is that if you out at 4am in the morning no matter who you are or where you are, you are at considerable higher risk of crime. The man also says that he is moving because south beach has gotten "too ghetto". That seems to imply personal prejudices that he is accusing everyone else of. On th eother end, Someone could say Ft Lah Dee Dah is "too faggoty". So we have biggoted homosexuals, biggoted heterosexuals. I say lets make South Beach all Jewsih and old people. Wait thats already happened. Did we have this conversation in the 80s? Its evolution. The place is fabulous for everybody. Come one Come all and spend your money!! Thats America!
Gay bars and clubs have been closing down in EVERY major city across the US including NY LA and ATL. Why? beacause our the younger generation of our community is more involved with the world as a whole not just our community. They go to bars and clubs that are open to everyone. Also, The article does not mention alternative means of meeting other gay people such as the internet.
I say let all of the blacks, straights, jewish, gays, freaks come and enjoy the beach. THAT is what makes Miami Beach different and a great place to live. Beware if you have a label for everybody else. What's yours?
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Brenda Torres 01/13/2010 5:28:00 PM
I cannot believe that with such important news you have given this article 5 pages.
I have known wonderful people throughout my life time who happen to be gay, but you don't have to do in the street or public places what you do in your bedroom with your partner; gay, heterosexual or whatever the person may be.
The immorality in Miami Beach was too much to handle; GOOD RIDDANCE!
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MS 01/13/2010 4:03:00 PM
Everyone is dancing around the real problem with S. Beach and that is increase in black tourists who have made no qualms about expressing their disgust for gay people. As long as the gay community refuses to take on this bigotry in the black community these attacks will continue. Its intensely ironic to hear many black people talk about gay people without any sense of what it is like to be a persecuted minority in the United States. You think there would be some sense of empathy but, no.
And not to say that there isn't plenty of this hate from the drunken rednecks from Nebraska...but its all driven by the acceptance of this hatred in our culture.
Until the Miami Beach P.D. takes the hammer of justice and beats these maggots out of existence, these attacks will continue.
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Carlos 01/13/2010 9:24:00 AM
(Miami Beach) a place the rest of the world sees as a big, happy gay rainbow.
Since when?
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pod 01/13/2010 8:19:00 AM
Oddly enough, we've been having a similar debate over on my forum (easy enough to find, not sure if NT allows external links or not in their comments) and this article really hit home for a lot of us. Our little community consists of the "older" segment of people in the nightlife world, on average, the bulk of us have been around these parts near a decade, with a strong tendency of the bell-curve to lean towards a decade or more "in country".
And my have things changed. A lot of the Founding Fathers of South Beach have left, and moved on to other things, to be replaced by some of the genius commentators above. It's almost as if the United States is trying to reabsorb Miami, after years of trying to kick it out.
Oh well, shit happens I guess. Best we can do is let the thugs, WASPs and pseudo-hipsters fight it out, take their money, and move on.
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Jules 01/13/2010 8:05:00 AM
South Beach in the late 90s, early 2000s was an amazing place. I hope someone documented those times on video. I would love to see a film documenting those days. I'm sure many people would be interested in seing it.
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Tara 01/13/2010 7:37:00 AM
Yes, that other witch pissed me off...
I am a breeder too hahahaha and yes, I have been championing gay rights for many years too. But hateful people make me insane. I've calmed down since I wrote that...
I lowered myself for a minute. Sorry.
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eve 01/13/2010 7:36:00 AM
I think its bad gay men are being beaten and killed. Its not right... and its true what the writer is saying - Miami Beach was a very openly Gay & friendly community. I am a straight female who worked at many of the clubs early 80's and 90's. It was cheap, beautiful, laid back, fun... Nowadays everything and everyone who made it cool - got pushed out by high rents... too many commercial places started popping up... its sad when you go to south beach and there's a Starbucks on every corner of Lincoln Rd... the best part about Miami is the cuban coffee and french lattes. to drink Starbucks in Miami is like eating Taco Bell in Mexico... I feel like everyone moved... not just gays, but stylist, artist, production people, etc. I dont go to Miami Beach unless there are waves. ( I surf )
Parking is a NIGHTMARE, Thugs and Wannabes on the weekends. Its a Mess...
I know Shelly, just from being in the nightclub business and she's right about all the cool places replaced by a Jerry's Deli, a Office Max, etc... Straight people went to these clubs too and miss them just as much as the gay men. Why??? No one bothered you, no one cared what the hell you were doing... People were just having fun & partying. It wasn't a tense place and thats why a lot of celeb's came down here without entourages and you would see so many here just walking around hanging out... its not like that anymore...
this is why I moved over the bridge... it's cheaper, I can park my car near the place I'm going, too many to list...
I miss the Old South Beach...
Eve
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Manny 01/13/2010 6:45:00 AM
Am so sick of Miami Beach... Been here too long since 1986 and I hate what it has evolved into, a big ghetto with noen and palm trees.
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Voltaire 01/13/2010 6:42:00 AM
Quote: "Breeders should stay off SOUTH BEACH!! Stay in Kendall, South Miami, or wherever you disgusting breeders live..."
Huh? Gay and pissy are we? I'm a breeder who champions everything that gays and lesbians contribute to culture but seriously, do you have to resort to such hateful comments?
The truth is, macho latinos and hip hop thug wannabes are the primary forces behind the South Beach violence toward gays. I cannot tell you how many times I've been to SoBe and seen packs of young "men" walking around looking for trouble. There is a need for more cops to deal with these idiots.
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freeport 01/13/2010 5:33:00 AM
I've lived on miami beach for many years..never a problem. of course i dont swish and advertise my sexual preference. those that flaunt their effeminacy are going to be a target. i would rather see fort lauderdale as the 'gay destination' and prefere a tourist base of straight Europeans.more money spent.of course when i first arrived in miami there were at least 30 gay clubs..now i can count them on one hand if not a few fingers.times change!
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Tara 01/13/2010 4:56:00 AM
You know what's even more disgusting...mothers who hate gays. I hope your children don't turn out to be gay because you are going to hate yourself for saying that.
What can I say? South Beach is not what it once was. I grew up there and I hate going now. All these mothers and fathers come with their bratty overindulged children and invade with their vulgar lifestyle. Ugh makes me want to kill some kids with their parents.
Breeders should stay off SOUTH BEACH!! Stay in Kendall, South Miami, or wherever you disgusting breeders live...
Seriously I hate so-called Christians...like being born Christian gives you a free pass to hate as much as possible.
You seriously can't smell the caca coming out of your mouth?
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Leslie 01/13/2010 4:54:00 AM
seriously,
why do people care so much about what gay people do. They are not hurting anyone or bothering anyone in any way. Just let them be. everyone has different opinions and ways to view certain aspects of life. Gay people should not be tormented or bothered because of their choices.
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FrancisRhule 01/13/2010 4:34:00 AM
This article is absurd!
As one who has monitored various sites to estimate
gay male populations, I would like to refute emphatially
the idea that gays are deserting S. Beach for Ft. Laud.
For example, on the most popular gay dating site in the U.S., Adam4adam.com., South Beach has over 5000 current members; Wilton Manors has 1200! Miami-Dade has over 27000 current members; Broward has just over 15000! On the 2nd most popular gay dating site in the U.S., Manhunt, S. Beach
again has over 5000 members and Dade has approx. 15000 members to Broward's 14800.
Also, S. Beach voter registration rolls have shown an increase of over 1800 more males new registrations than female ones since 2000; without doubt, this likely points to more gays living here than in 2000.
These FACTS make your report a pathetic attempt to do what? Try to pretend gays don't live in South Beach anymore?
Just open your eyes and see who leaves the doors of all the condoes and apartments in S. Beach each morning.
Last year, Miami reported approx. 4 gay hate crimes to Broward's 9. Why did you allowing such irresponsible reporting?
Again, New Times, apparently supports sensational coverage with little regard to the truth.
Shameful!
Francis, S.Beach
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Ryan 01/13/2010 3:30:00 AM
I'm a straight man who lived in SB in the early 00's and it was still a good time back then. But it's not just the GLBT faction that's been forced out, it's pretty much all the decent people. After the second time getting jumped by a gang of cowardly thugs, I figured it was time to move on. Scenes change, that's just the nature of things. I refuse to go there now, even when out of town friends and family insist (I blame CSI). Let the idiot tourists and pretentious poseurs and wannabe thugs have it. Lament it all you want, but I say rot in Hell South Beach.
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jason 01/13/2010 3:12:00 AM
Where to start? The assaults and murders are wrong. But I have issues with those stories being blended in with the story of the person walking around and being sad because the gay bar is now an Office depot and another place is a doctor's office. So what!? I have been to south beach and it is a good place to go. I have also been to Fort Lauderdale. I frequent LuLu's on the beach.
If the gays are allowed to have GLBT bookstores then straight people can have businesses that cater to their demographic. Why is it sad when a gay business shuts down but not sad when a business shuts down that caters to straight people or families?
I have seen straight people harassed at lulu's by gays and nothing is done about it. If other people are gay that is fine and their business but I am not and personally deplore the act of sodomy. So when I am approached by gays they don't understand this or care. I have seen gays act nasty and say even nastier things and think they are above the law because of their gay status.
This is america. Someone is suppose to NOT take advantage of the better real estate prices and sale to office depot so some gay can have a place to get drunk? That is stupid.
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Pinguo 01/12/2010 11:58:00 PM
she probably tring to pick up some mandingo cock got bitch pwned